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	<title>Comments on: Back off, man. I&#8217;m a scientist.</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.spectrecollie.com/archives/2008/10/back-off-man-im-a-scientist/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.spectrecollie.com/archives/2008/10/back-off-man-im-a-scientist/</link>
	<description>Chuck Jordan's Personal Weblog</description>
	<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 01:31:08 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Chuck</title>
		<link>http://www.spectrecollie.com/archives/2008/10/back-off-man-im-a-scientist/comment-page-1/#comment-13514</link>
		<dc:creator>Chuck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Oct 2008 22:04:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.spectrecollie.com/?p=905#comment-13514</guid>
		<description>Not for being too "absurd," but puzzles are being constantly reworked, revised, or removed altogether.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not for being too &#8220;absurd,&#8221; but puzzles are being constantly reworked, revised, or removed altogether.</p>
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		<title>By: Erik</title>
		<link>http://www.spectrecollie.com/archives/2008/10/back-off-man-im-a-scientist/comment-page-1/#comment-13511</link>
		<dc:creator>Erik</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Oct 2008 19:31:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.spectrecollie.com/?p=905#comment-13511</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;there’s nothing that makes adventure games particularly smarter, they’re just a different type of game.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Yeah, I suppose you're right. 

Maybe what I meant is the logic of no logic (back to the scavenger hunt, combine Y + B + C) whatsoever is where I do most of my head scratching. At that point I'll seek out a walk through and enjoy the game that way. However, avoiding the puzzles is a key part of an adventure game and I believe that can kill the experience somewhat.

Have you guys ever tossed out a puzzle idea for it being too absurd?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>there’s nothing that makes adventure games particularly smarter, they’re just a different type of game.</p></blockquote>
<p>Yeah, I suppose you&#8217;re right. </p>
<p>Maybe what I meant is the logic of no logic (back to the scavenger hunt, combine Y + B + C) whatsoever is where I do most of my head scratching. At that point I&#8217;ll seek out a walk through and enjoy the game that way. However, avoiding the puzzles is a key part of an adventure game and I believe that can kill the experience somewhat.</p>
<p>Have you guys ever tossed out a puzzle idea for it being too absurd?</p>
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		<title>By: Chuck</title>
		<link>http://www.spectrecollie.com/archives/2008/10/back-off-man-im-a-scientist/comment-page-1/#comment-13505</link>
		<dc:creator>Chuck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Oct 2008 07:45:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.spectrecollie.com/?p=905#comment-13505</guid>
		<description>Well, speak up any time you see me rambling about adventure games, because I've been playing them for almost 2 decades, so there's a lot of stuff I take as a given. And I'm still trying to figure out exactly why they turn some people off.

When you say "don't have the brains to come up with clever solutions," that should set off alarms for anybody who works on adventure games, since there's nothing that makes adventure games particularly &lt;em&gt;smarter&lt;/em&gt;, they're just a different type of game.

And yeah, I agree that Half-Life 2 does a great job with pacing &#8212; part of the reason it's one of my favorite games is because it knows how to go from quiet moments to jumping a speedboat over an exploding tanker truck with music pounding and bombs going off all around you. But I think the pacing is used in a cinematic way, and games can do more than that. Having a quiet moment just for the sake of contrast is something a movie would do; having a quiet moment so you can stop for a second and figure out what you're supposed to do next and figure out how it ties into the overall story is something a game can do. It's more active, and less reactive.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, speak up any time you see me rambling about adventure games, because I&#8217;ve been playing them for almost 2 decades, so there&#8217;s a lot of stuff I take as a given. And I&#8217;m still trying to figure out exactly why they turn some people off.</p>
<p>When you say &#8220;don&#8217;t have the brains to come up with clever solutions,&#8221; that should set off alarms for anybody who works on adventure games, since there&#8217;s nothing that makes adventure games particularly <em>smarter</em>, they&#8217;re just a different type of game.</p>
<p>And yeah, I agree that Half-Life 2 does a great job with pacing &mdash; part of the reason it&#8217;s one of my favorite games is because it knows how to go from quiet moments to jumping a speedboat over an exploding tanker truck with music pounding and bombs going off all around you. But I think the pacing is used in a cinematic way, and games can do more than that. Having a quiet moment just for the sake of contrast is something a movie would do; having a quiet moment so you can stop for a second and figure out what you&#8217;re supposed to do next and figure out how it ties into the overall story is something a game can do. It&#8217;s more active, and less reactive.</p>
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		<title>By: Erik</title>
		<link>http://www.spectrecollie.com/archives/2008/10/back-off-man-im-a-scientist/comment-page-1/#comment-13502</link>
		<dc:creator>Erik</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Oct 2008 17:14:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.spectrecollie.com/?p=905#comment-13502</guid>
		<description>You know, Chuck, with these long, well thought out entries you might just have to compile them into a book. I've clipped this on Delicious to read later, but I did read a bit of it.

As for "point &#38; click" games, I've always enjoyed the overall story behind them but the puzzle aspect is something I have a hard time grasping. Games like Day of the Tentacle and Monkey Island, fantastic production values (for their time) with great stories to tell but having to combine object A with object Z, then jam those into C? Not my idea of fun. I guess I just don't have the brains to come up with clever solutions, or clueless ones at that.

Case in point: I love Sam &#38; Max and what you guys at Telltale have done is awesome (art direction, storyline, dialogue). When it comes down to doing a scavenger hunt, that just doesn't interest me I guess. However, that said, the puzzles that make sense (not compiling a hot dog with a calculator) in the context of the game, I do like those. Maybe Sam &#38; Max is a bad example since it's just so off the wall.

I thought the puzzle to become Homestar to participate in the race was pretty cool.

Off that topic, sorry, you bring up some great points in game design. As for this: "Every Good Killing Spree Needs Time to Reflect", I thought Half-Life 2 did a good job with this. There were down times in the game to allow the player to explore things and think about what just happened and what will happen moments from that point.

Pacing is key and I'd imagine it's a difficult thing to do. What would've Doom been like if every 10 minutes, you'd be dumped in an empty room (with an altar of solitude or something) to reflect on your killing spree? Don't think it works in run and gun shooters, but a thinking shooter like Half-Life needs that.

Again, great post. It really made me ponder a lot of facets of game design.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You know, Chuck, with these long, well thought out entries you might just have to compile them into a book. I&#8217;ve clipped this on Delicious to read later, but I did read a bit of it.</p>
<p>As for &#8220;point &amp; click&#8221; games, I&#8217;ve always enjoyed the overall story behind them but the puzzle aspect is something I have a hard time grasping. Games like Day of the Tentacle and Monkey Island, fantastic production values (for their time) with great stories to tell but having to combine object A with object Z, then jam those into C? Not my idea of fun. I guess I just don&#8217;t have the brains to come up with clever solutions, or clueless ones at that.</p>
<p>Case in point: I love Sam &amp; Max and what you guys at Telltale have done is awesome (art direction, storyline, dialogue). When it comes down to doing a scavenger hunt, that just doesn&#8217;t interest me I guess. However, that said, the puzzles that make sense (not compiling a hot dog with a calculator) in the context of the game, I do like those. Maybe Sam &amp; Max is a bad example since it&#8217;s just so off the wall.</p>
<p>I thought the puzzle to become Homestar to participate in the race was pretty cool.</p>
<p>Off that topic, sorry, you bring up some great points in game design. As for this: &#8220;Every Good Killing Spree Needs Time to Reflect&#8221;, I thought Half-Life 2 did a good job with this. There were down times in the game to allow the player to explore things and think about what just happened and what will happen moments from that point.</p>
<p>Pacing is key and I&#8217;d imagine it&#8217;s a difficult thing to do. What would&#8217;ve Doom been like if every 10 minutes, you&#8217;d be dumped in an empty room (with an altar of solitude or something) to reflect on your killing spree? Don&#8217;t think it works in run and gun shooters, but a thinking shooter like Half-Life needs that.</p>
<p>Again, great post. It really made me ponder a lot of facets of game design.</p>
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